Thoughts on celebrity pastors

Kevin DeYoung penned a post titled 7 Theses on “Celebrity Pastors” that presents a counter-point to the growing murmuring about the dangers of hero worship and cult of personality that pervades the church. It is something of a self-serving post since Kevin is an up-and-coming “celebrity” himself but he makes some interesting points. I think in total that he misses the big problem with all of this hero worship, i.e. that most of the men who are “celebrities” in the church are followed by other men who don’t really know a thing about them.

Here was my comment:

The missing link here is subtle but important. We see these men on stage in their immaculate suits and their soaring oratorical skills and want to be just like them (or worse expect our local pastor to be just like them). We are often encouraged to imitate or emulate men in the Bible but what is it about their lives we are supposed to emulate? How well they speak, how eloquently they preach, their skill in teaching? In a word, no. Paul in 2 Thess 3:7-10 speaks of the example he set but it was not an example of writing swell books and speaking at the best conferences. It was working a job, not being idle, being an example of work for the church. In Hebrews 13:7 we are told to “Consider the outcome of their way of life, and imitate their faith.”. Sound words but how are we to do that for men we don’t know?

Honestly, how many men who attend Together for the Gospel or similar conferences have a clue what sort of life Al Mohler or Mark Dever leads? I am confident that their lives are praiseworthy but I don’t KNOW them so it is pretty hard to “imitate” a man I don’t know. What I know of Al Mohler I know from reading his books and blog, listening to his radio show back in the day and his podcasts and following his Tweets. That is hardly solid ground on which to imitate a man.

Christians follow “celebrity” pastors like John MacArthur, John Piper and even Kevin DeYoung because of their books and their talks. I used to live about ten minutes from the church Kevin pastors and I know lots of godly men in that area who live lives worthy of emulation. I also know that if you invited these men to speak at a conference, few people would show up because they lack name recognition and are perhaps not as polished in speaking as some of the “celebrity” pastors. I would say the average Christian man can learn a lot more from another faithful and more mature Christian man that he actually knows and can have access to who works a regular job and cares for his family than he could by devouring hours and hours of sermons and conference talks from even the very best “celebrity” pastor. Even the most pious Reformed American is in danger of getting caught up in the desire for entertainment and performance and for many of us listening to a well prepared and presented conference talk is every bit as entertaining as Jersey Shore is for someone else.

We would all do better to quit spending gobs of time and money buying yet another book by a “celebrity” pastor or attending yet another conference full of the big name speakers and instead spend more time building relationships with other “regular” men, men we can develop actual relationships with (and following someone on Twitter is not an actual relationship) and observe their lives as examples for our own. That is hard work and sometimes messy in contrast to a neat and tidy hour long conference talk but it is also infinitely richer.

I honestly believe that and that is a radical change for me as someone who used to attend several theology conferences a year and I would pick them based on the "quality" of the speakers. I am also expecting some grief over the comparison between going to a conference and Jersey Shore but so be it.

Is there value in learning from men like Mohler and Piper? I certainly think so otherwise I wouldn’t read what they write and listen to what the say. I think what is crucial is that we recognize the inherent limitations in this long distance relationship. Just as I don’t personally know, as in never met or spent any actual time with, Alan Knox or Dave Black or Eric Carpenter, I still find reading what they write to be instructive. Of course given all of our rather limited audiences I also can have interaction online with these men, something that is not really feasible for a John MacArthur.

We need to cultivate relationships with other Christians where we are. Those are the relationships that will ultimately have real Kingdom impact on our lives as fathers and brothers and husbands (let’s be honest, this phenomena of celebrity in the church is largely a dude thing) are those relationships with men we know. The men who I know and who I interact with in real life are not famous authors and are not getting invited to speak at conferences in front of hundreds or thousands of people but they are real life influences that God has placed in my path and I am thankful for them. Sure they have quirks and foibles but those are the things you find out and eventually cherish about them, things that you never see in an hour long talk at a conference.

More on the cult of celebrity

Very interesting post from Carl Trueman at Reformation 21 on the dangers of the celebrity pastor culture in the church, especially among the reformed where everyone wants to be the next Ligon Duncan or John Piper. Carl notes that a ministry where you don’t know the people you are supposed to minister to is not one that anyone should strive for.

Frankly, who wants a ministry where you do not get to know people anyway? Is that not a major part of what ministry is meant to be?

When a man is the “senior pastor” of a church with thousands of “members” or regular attendees, how is he pastoring them in any real sense? Sure they listen to his sermons weekly but they (and I) can do the same thing from my computer at home without the hassle of getting dressed up, driving somewhere and sitting silently in a pew for 45 minutes. Yet many men hold these celebrity conference speakers up as the paragons of ministry. They write best selling books, they are invited to Larry King Live and for interviews with Time magazine, they have the best read blogs, their podcasts gets thousands of downloads, they are often quoted on Facebook or have snippets of their sermons embedded from YouTube and they are the speakers that are the most in demand.

But are they ministering to the people they are supposed to be ministering to? How well do they know the people in their local church, the people who are left behind while their pastor is off to another conference to speak? If that is left to the other staff members, are they a “pastor” in any sort of Biblical sense?

Ministry has everything to do with serving people and to serve them you must know them and be known by them and people don’t get to know you based on how many of your books they have read or how many conference talks of yours they have listened to.

(HT: Les Prouty)

Why are celebrities so weird?

What makes "famous" people feel the need to be so odd?

This news report came out and no one even blinked...

NEW YORK — Matthew McConaughey says the birth of his son will help bring a little joy to others in the world someday. The actor kept the placenta from the July birth of his son and plans to plant it in an orchard, he said in a cable news interview.

McConaughey says he hopes it will fertilize the land, a ritual long followed in several cultures.

"It's going to be in the orchards and it's going to bear some wonderful fruit," he says, according to an interview transcript. "When I was in Australia, they had a placenta tree that was on the river ... and all the placentas of all that tribe, all that clan, whatever aboriginal tribe that was, all the placentas went under that one tree and it was this huge behemoth of just health and strength.

"This tree was just growing taller and stronger above the rest of Mother Nature around it. It was gorgeous."

OK, see that is just kind of odd. I have looked upon my fair share of placentas and never, I mean never, had the urge to take one home and bury it under a tree. No one asked why in the world you would do that instead of paying a landscaper to fertilize the tree, especially since he is filthy rich. Nope, people just nod and say "Hmm, that is really deep. Celebrities are SOOOO wise and worldly!"

The answer of course is that these people flat out need Christ. Because they are guilty about their wealth and that they are surrounded by sycophants who never question them and whisper sweet platitudes in their ears, they begin to think of themselves as being wiser than the average American because they are more famous than the average America. But Joe Six Pack doesn't feel the need to bury a placenta under a "placenta tree", or wear a bottle of their mate's blood in a vial around their neck or have people spray their favorite mist into a room before they enter. Celebs don't worship God because they are worshipped by others as gods among us.

For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things. Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen. (Romans 1:19-25)