tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6643715.post6733068591887554287..comments2023-06-09T12:46:12.932-04:00Comments on The Voice Of One Crying Out In Suburbia: Happy violation of Romans 13 Day!Arthur Sidohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03848508095612688493noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6643715.post-3157447112626760212014-07-17T21:41:43.405-04:002014-07-17T21:41:43.405-04:00Presumptuous? Only if God had not already given Hi...Presumptuous? Only if God had not already given His followers inviolable enemy love commandments that would disqualify them from armed rebellion, unless one is suggesting that the revolutionaries received some sort of special dispensation that submission to King George was unnecessary. Arthur Sidohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03848508095612688493noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6643715.post-25041969163669523352014-07-10T11:30:21.469-04:002014-07-10T11:30:21.469-04:00“God tells us to submit to the authorities that He...“God tells us to submit to the authorities that He raises up, it does not follow that He expects His followers to do the raising up and casting down, especially when the means for doing so run counter to the commands of Christ.” <br /><br />Is it presumptuous to declare to know “who” God will or will not use to raise up a government – regardless of one’s opinions about the commands of Christ or the actions of said government?Neil Braithwaitenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6643715.post-87867387153774500702014-07-10T10:47:30.930-04:002014-07-10T10:47:30.930-04:00Neil, would you say that Christians who were part ...Neil, would you say that Christians who were part of the rise of the Third Reich were also doing God's will for His people?<br /><br />God can cause things to happen as part of His sovereign will while not involving His people. It was His will to crucify His Son but He didn't ask the apostles to do it. God tells us to submit to the authorities that He raises up, it does not follow that He expects His followers to do the raising up and casting down, especially when the means for doing so run counter to the commands of Christ.Arthur Sidohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03848508095612688493noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6643715.post-53481593730435728772014-07-09T19:52:59.702-04:002014-07-09T19:52:59.702-04:00My point was that there cannot be a “God” ordained...My point was that there cannot be a “God” ordained government without a “God” ordained action to create that government. That’s why I asked at what point a government becomes “God” ordained. Why would God ordain something He had no hand in creating? It wouldn’t make sense.<br /><br />Romans 13 answers this question very clearly. “For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God.” The Greek word for “instituted” is tassó: to draw up in order, arrange. <br /><br />God draws up in order and arranges governments by His power and ordained authority. So regardless of how any government is created; by consent, rebellion or war, it’s by God’s authority alone. <br /><br />The founding fathers (a great number professing Jesus as Lord), regardless of their motives, were doing God’s will rebelling against a tyrannical King, declaring independence and establishing a new sovereign government.Neil Braithwaitenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6643715.post-8309831313689683882014-07-09T14:07:42.720-04:002014-07-09T14:07:42.720-04:00Very good post Chuck!Very good post Chuck!Arthur Sidohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03848508095612688493noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6643715.post-49660906507409327672014-07-09T14:06:45.588-04:002014-07-09T14:06:45.588-04:00Neil, there are two issues at play here.
Is the U...Neil, there are two issues at play here.<br /><br />Is the U.S. a legitimate government? Sure, it is at least as legit as any other secular nation.<br /><br />Was the armed rebellion the work of a "Judeo-Christian worldview", creating a nation built on "Christian principles", as many would argue? No.<br /><br />Like I said in the post, the rationale for rebellion might have been legit, but, and this is the important part, Christians are never called to violently rebel against the government. If Christians were never commanded to rebel again Rome and indeed were commanded to do the opposite, then it is ludicrous to assume that there was a legitimate Christian rationale for rebelling against England.Arthur Sidohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03848508095612688493noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6643715.post-24877722697777771072014-07-08T09:27:53.050-04:002014-07-08T09:27:53.050-04:00Have you considered that “governing authorities” a...Have you considered that “governing authorities” are not eternal entities and that they all have (had) a beginning? By what (or whose) rule did the governing authorities you sight come into existence? At what point does God bestow on a government His authority? At its inception? After it has proven itself worthy in some way? Just what exactly are God’s rules and conditions to become a legitimate governing authority? <br /><br />At what point did England (and King George) become a “God ordained” governing authority? <br /><br />And for that matter, at what point did the government of the United States of America become a God ordained authority? Or has it?<br /><br />By your argument, can I assume that you believe America’s “governing authority” is at the least questionable, and at the most illegitimate? And if it’s not legitimate, should we as Christians be compelled to submit to it? <br /><br />At what point did Rome become a “God ordained” governing authority? As brutal and conquering a regime as they were you would think that would have somehow disqualified them as a “Godly” authority.Neil Braithwaitenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6643715.post-91110733819889965742014-07-06T14:45:09.229-04:002014-07-06T14:45:09.229-04:00I'm getting to this a bit late (was just getti...I'm getting to this a bit late (was just getting caught up on my Feedly), but great post, Arthur! I argued similarly on my blog as well: http://www.beingfilled.com/2014/07/what-did-jesus-think-of-revolution.htmlChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12532545334918585147noreply@blogger.com